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Hoffmann later [1955?] writes that in this year he was talking to Hitler in his atelier, and after realizing that Hitler was on the Odeonsplatz that day, they searched for him in Hoffmann's photos of the event, albeit without success.
Assessment: I wonder whether Hoffmann used that time to mount another photo of Hitler into the crowd--it's a very fishy story, also that the famous photo wasn't published for two more years. German historian Gerd Krumeich, one of the foremost experts on World War I, publishes essays in which he expresses doubts about the authenticity of the photo. Undoubtedly finding the negative would settle the question, as none of the reasons provided are in any way airtight, as you say. If it were a forgery, and the evidence for that doesn't appear overwhelmingly convincing, it would make sense that it would be of a superior quality than Stalin's shoddy attempts. This is the most inane of the reasons given as it is entirely uncertain exactly what Hitler's appearance was at that time.
I've read that Hoffmann got the idea from Hitler to examine the photos with a magnifying glass.
Unless Hitler had Scotty transport him to his historic prominent position in front, it can safely be supposed that he had to make his way through the crowd and occupied more than one position throughout the day. While these suppositions are hardly enough to declare the famous picture a fraud, one should not just rule out the possibility. It does seem to me that the Hitler in the photo is a later Hitler, compared with the Hitler in the army. Europe in general seemed to have the same hair style at the time doesn't help much, either.
It is typical that when someone posts with a certain tone, others respond in a similar manner automatically. Another 7 months passed between January 1914 and August 1914, when he was accepted into the German army. The evidence against the authenticity of the picture is completely circumstantial, and the opinion on whether or not that is how Hitler would have looked in 1914 is purely subjective.
The 'stache is a little wider, to my eyes, and his face is battle worn but basically the same.
I was the original poster about the German news article discussing possibility that the photo of Hitler at the Feldherrenhalle gathering in Munich in August 1914 might be a forgery. Well, after looking very closely at the photo (and the video clip on youtube--thanks Wally!--which quickly and seamlessly switches to the photo), I have some questions. When I blow up the blow-up of Hitler in my browser, I looks like the shoulder of the man in the black bowler hat to Hitler's right overlaps Hitler's right cheek.
If true, this is the only potentially convincing evidence yet presented for this thesis. I can relate to the difficulties involved in finding the time for all the various projects one would like to complete. Thanks again for your introduction of this thread; it is the most interesting since the Aristocrat Mustache Affair, and far more historically valuable. Wally, there was one other fairly convincing piece of evidence: The 1914 photo was published in a 1936 propaganda brochure opposite a 1918 photo of another gathering in Munich--with Hitler visible in that one too!
I ordered several of the books from interlibrary loans (NONE are in my library), but it will take a while to get them, and I'll be busy by then with other things. Oh, and note that I found a non-colored version of the blow-up that doesn't have the man's shoulder in front of Hitler's right cheek. I'm glad you've been able to catch up, and hope to hear your thoughts and opinions while you have a break from school. Epic, the 2013 American computer-animated 3D comedy-drama fantasy-adventure film, is loosely based on the childrena€™s book named a€?The Leaf Men and the Brave Good Bugsa€? by William Joyce.
The above collection includes some of the best wallpapers based on the 2013 film, especially for those who love this movie and are enthusiastic about animated wallpapers in general. Hoffmann says that he later found another plate (negative) that was supposed to be destroyed, on which Hitler was indeed visible. 32f, see 1974, below), Hoffmann tells a story about a day in 1930 when Hitler stopped by his studio, noticed a photo from the August 1914 series, and told Hoffmann that he had been in the crowd. 1: On the 20th anniversary of the outbreak of World War I the Illustrated Observer reprinted the photo.
1914 photo opposite a 1918 photo of a gathering in which Hitler was supposedly also visible.


32f, Hoffmann gives a page-long anecdote about the finding of the photo that sounds rather fishy (see 1930, above).
For him, the photo spread in the 1936 brochure, as well as the existence of several versions of the 1914 photo with different placement of Hitler's" forehead hair, indicate that it was at least retouched if not forged. 9, 2010: I (Marcuse) begin a thread on the 3rdReichStudies yahoo group list, documented below. The state of the art in Germany at the time was decades ahead of anyone, and they led the world in optics, which was a major component of photographic manipulation.
The picture was supposedly discovered by Hitler and Hoffmann in 1929, but not used in 1930 when photographer Hoffmann's magazine Illustrierter Beobachter printed a different picture of the gathering. He assured him that he was indeed in the crowd that day and that it would be advantageous to find the proof of it was already in their possession. No negative of the image has been preserved, but several prints from it, showing Hitler's drooping forehead hair in different positions. The fact that there were a number of prints with Hitler's hair in various crowd-jostled states seems inoccious. Of course, the reason could be as simple as the fact that since the famous photo saw publication that its near-twins did not, it was probably separated from its brothers and not later reunited. A film clip of the gathering recently discovered by Thomas Weber (author of Hitler's First War, 2010), shows a man resembling Hitler, but farther back in the crowd, near the Theatiner church, not in this prominent position near the front.
As an open question, it is intriguing and should not be dismissed out of hand as Hitler and his crew were capable of all manner of subterfuge. One of my books, a pictorial which is the companion book to a documentary made on the Nazis shows homeless German men sitting on a sidewalk with their feet in the gutter.
The man in the photo has what seems to me to be a fuller, rounder face shape than Hitler had.
Between 1905 and 1915, there are no known pictures of him, and the 1905 image of a 16 year-old Hitler is merely a drawing.
Hitler himself explains that while in Vienna his condition was less-than-healthy due to his down-and-out status, and this certainly rings true. It is reasonable to assume that while he was probably in no way what one could consider robust at that point, his health had improved to the point that he was accepted. When I look at that famous picture, it strikes me that that is just how Hitler would have looked in 1914, extrapolating from his well-known 1915 appearance. However, it seems to me that the evidence against the pictures authenticity is far from compelling, and one would hope that evidence of a more substantial nature would have to be presented to judge it a hoax. The article clearly states that there is as yet no way of definitively deciding the matter, which I included in my summary. I have always assumed that it was Hitler wafting his own hat, but that cannot be--there is a man's blurry face right below it, clearly visible in the blow-up.
14, not in December, my mistake) makes clear that the multiple prints of this photo in Hoffmann's archive are identical EXCEPT for Hitler's hairline, providing clear evidence that the photo had been at least touched up.
14, not in December, my mistake) makes clear that the multiple prints of this photo in Hoffmann's archive are identical EXCEPT for Hitler's hairline, providing clear evidence that the photo had been at least touched up. I would be very interested in examining these prints, and am looking forward to the testimony of experts on the matter. Someday when I have time (ha ha) I will add these to a web page I began about specific "myths" (misconceptions) in German history.
I am currently working on finished drafts of the rest of the Nuremberg Defendants, the next chapter of the ongoing Hitler biography, an annotated Mein Kampf, bio's of Goebbels, Bormann, and Himmler, and a detailed Cold War chronology. For German historian Krumeich, who raised the doubt originally, that is the most convincing evidence.
Like most other popular animated feature films, Epic has become a highly searched for subject for desktop and laptop wallpapers. The group moderator found on youtube the clip of a 1914 news film (according to the comments there it was shown in a BBC documentary) showing that same crowd, including a man who at least resembles Hitler (in a different spot in the crowd). Hoffmann couldn't find him in any of the plates, sent Hitler to a cafe, then found it on a plate that had been sorted out for destruction. 1914 picture with Hitler for the first time, with a magnifying-glass-like enlargement of his face.
Whether or not he was sporting a mustache is not documented, but he had had a mustache of various sorts off and on since the age of 17 when he grew his first as a young walk-about in Linz, and would have one during the War.


However, were I compelled to make a bet on the issue, as the weight of the evidence now stands I would wager the picture is authentic.
Whether one can grow a mustache of his army size one from a toothbrush, in the time available, I don't know.
However, from the numerous descriptions we have from his various acquaintances, we know that 1) his usual thin and unsubstantial appearance was made even more so by his years as a homeless man in Vienna, and 2) he experimented with various types of mustaches over these years, sporting 'staches from handlebar to a thin line. He was eating in soup kitchens, and while the usual fare of such charitable institutions will allow a fellow to survive, they are hardly hearty enough to promote a robust constitution.
It is unreasonable to assume that he would have been allowed to enlist if he had not been found to be fit enough. But as I say, mine is a subjective opinion and not intrinsically superior to the other opinions so far expressed that it doesn't look like Hitler. Still, I found the possibility to be of interest because Hitler was so adept at manipulating what the public thought about him, and, IF TRUE, doctoring this photo would be further evidence of the skill and success of that strategy, as well as a warning to historians to consider the authenticity of ALL evidence carefully before using it. This isn't really a question, but I wonder whether anyone else thought it was Hitler waving his hat? I admit to having been fooled by a few of these spurious images--including the gas van and the synagogue--and would be grateful to have information available to factually delineate between the false and the reliable in this area.
Visual evidence is often far more convincing than someone reporting something (even if they claim to have a document).
The epic wallpapers feature the principal characters from the movie with different varieties including important scenes from Epic as har vokse review well as the movie posters.
And the idea that Hitler--who was rooming with a tailor and his wife at the time--did not own a suit is ludicrous.
If it is Hitler in the photo, it means that he had a toothbrush in 1914, grew the long drooping one in the army, then went back to a toothbrush. The caption on the photo stresses that even when things were bad in Germany between the wars, men were eager to get work, and knew they had better chances if they were neatly dressed. In other words, anyone wishing to receive a measured response to their comments would be well-served keep this phenomenon in mind. There are a series of pictures of Hitler in the early 1920's modeling various looks (below is one of them; notice the wider-than-usual mustache), including a variety of mustaches, demonstrating that he did not settle on his signature 'stache until shortly after he began his political career. All accounts of the period agree that there was hardly a shortage of willing recruits and the authorities would not have been inclined to scrape the bottom of the barrel. Remember that (forged) national guard document that showed "W" Bush didn't attend his service? The brilliant and colorful wallpapers are sure to brighten up the home screen, preventing you from getting bored of working long hours on the computer.
Hitler always preferred to dress as well as his means allowed, and Popp the Tailor no doubt was able to offer him a very good discount as the two were quite friendly. They may have not had homes, but they were certainly trying to increase their chances at getting employment by keeping themselves neatly groomed and dressed as well as possible.
If one is fishing for a confrontation ("Everybody knows that" - "What a mistake for a so-called expert" - "You just wish it was fake"), they will get one.
Although the statement was true, someone needed to have a visual document to get traction on the claim. I did notice that some of the suits did not fit quite right, and I took that to mean they were probably purchased second-hand or given outright by people who could afford to do so. If they were looking for conversation to begin with, one would think that they would not post in such an abrasive manner. Did you ever notice that anyone who is hypnotized and *remembers* a former life is always someone famous? Lots of damage to the Nazi cause at the polls, but ultimately not enough to keep them out of power.



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